Authentic Achievements with Special Guest Lisa Ventura MBE
Unlocking Cyber Security Insights with Lisa Ventura MBE | Authentic Achievements Podcast
Welcome back to another insightful episode of Authentic Achievements! We’re honoured to have a distinguished guest, Lisa Ventura MBE, in this episode. Lisa is an award-winning cyber security specialist, a published writer, keynote speaker, and the Founder of Cyber Security Unity. Her expertise spans various domains including cyberpsychology, neurodiversity, and AI in cybersecurity. Join us as we delve into her journey, insights, and the pressing issues in the cyber world.
Key Discussion Points:
1. Lisa’s Journey: Discover Lisa Ventura’s remarkable journey from humble beginnings to becoming an MBE-awarded figure in cyber security. Learn about the pivotal moments and challenges that shaped her career trajectory.
2. Cyber Security Unity: Explore Lisa’s brainchild, Cyber Security Unity, a global community organization that unites individuals and organizations combating cyber threats. Uncover this initiative’s mission, objectives, and impact in fortifying cyber defence worldwide.
3. Human Factors in Cybersecurity: Gain valuable insights into the critical yet often overlooked aspect of cyber security – the human element. Lisa’s expertise in cyberpsychology sheds light on how human behaviour influences cyber risks and strategies to mitigate them effectively.
4. Neurodiversity and AI in Cyber: Delve into Lisa’s specialist knowledge in neurodiversity and its intersection with cyber security. Learn how embracing neurodiversity can enhance innovation and problem-solving in the cybersecurity landscape. Furthermore, it explores the role of AI in augmenting cyber defence capabilities and its implications.
5. Imposter Syndrome Awareness: Lisa’s role as the Co-Founder of International Imposter Syndrome Awareness Day underscores her commitment to fostering a supportive and inclusive environment in the cybersecurity community. Understand the prevalence of imposter syndrome and strategies to combat it.
As we wrap up this episode of Authentic Achievements, we thank Lisa Ventura MBE for sharing her profound insights and expertise in cyber security. Her dedication to promoting collaboration, diversity, and awareness in cyber defence inspires all. Stay tuned for more episodes where we uncover the stories of authentic achievers making a difference in their respective fields.
To find out more about Lisa visit https://www.csu.org.uk or connect with her at Twitter – @cybergeekgirl and @cybersecunity LinkedIn – / lisasventura Facebook – / lisasventurauk Instagram – / lsventurauk YouTube – / @cybersecuritylisa
We hope you enjoyed the show, and we would love to hear your thoughts; please comment below or contact me at kimadele@authenticachievments.com #CyberSecurity#AuthenticAchievementsPodcast#CybersecurityUnity#ImposterSyndromeAwareness
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Transcript:
[Music]
0:06[Applause] hello and welcome to this episode of authentic achievements where I am beyond
0:13delighted to be joined by my good friend Lisa Ventura MBE but before I introduce
0:18her to you Lisa welcome hi Kim it’s great to be here thank you oh it’s great to have you here
0:25and I’m so looking forward to sharing your journey and your story with our audience but before we get started let
0:30me tell them a little bit more about you so Leisa is an award-winning cyber security specialist a published writer
0:37and author a keynote speaker she’s the founder of cyber security Unity a global
0:42commun Community organization that’s dedicated to Bringing individuals and organizations together who actively work
0:49in cyber security to help combat the growing cyber threat as a consultant Lisa also works with cyber security
0:56leadership teams to help them work together more effectively and provides cyber security awareness and culture
1:02training and training on the benefits of hiring those who are neurodiverse she has a specialist knowledge in the human
1:08factors of cyber security cyber psychology neurodiversity and AI in cyber and is also co-founder of
1:15international imposter syndrome awareness day and a great friend where do you fit all in
1:22L things to be involved with absolutely Kim and it’s something I’m asked a lot
1:28because there is so much that I do and I pack a lot you know into my you know my days my weeks my months
1:35and I think for me really it goes back around to 10 or so years ago because I
1:42was on a very very different trajectory so in 2013 I was expecting my
1:50um first baby and when I was about halfway through the pregnancy he was um
1:56diagnosed with quite a few things that were wrong with him in neutro so I I knew I was prepared for um the fact he
2:03would have significant disabilities and for being a mother that would have to give 24-hour Around the Clock hair to my
2:10son when he was here and I was prepared for that I was already for it but closer
2:15to his G date he was in fact still born and so I prepared for this one life this
2:22life of being a 24 hours a day mother to my son and then just as abruptly I’m
2:28taking off that trajectory and I’m back on to another one and what helped me heal I think from that was
2:36throwing into my myself into work um after he was born and after we had the
2:42funeral and and so on and I didn’t go on to have any other um children because I was then diagnosed with a rare um
2:49complication that meant that that would be um difficult to do so I kind of just got my head around all this and in fact
2:55I posted this morning funly enough on my um on my LinkedIn because having now um
3:01gone through the what is a natural part of life which is the menopause those days are now you know well behind me so
3:09I guess for me I just really threw myself into my work and really focused
3:14on that to um you know just give me something to do and just give me another Focus another pathway another thing that
3:22I could you know excel at and um you know something I could just really devote my time to because I’d failed so
3:30spectacularly on the motherhood front I channeled everything into the um career
3:35side of things and so that’s the kind of answer I guess is to how I fit it all in
3:40because I don’t have those commitments that many other people um do um I don’t
3:46have caring you know commitments I don’t have children so I have my dog Poppy and she’s a big part of my life and a big um
3:53chunk of My Life um but for for me that’s why I focus everything into into
3:58my career and and do so much amazing and I’m as you know I’m so so sorry for for
4:05your L and can’t begin to imagine just what that must be like um I had my own
4:12miscarriage but was then lucky to go on and have my little girl so I my heart goes out to you because I can only
4:19scratch the surface at what that must have been like and and con see that obviously that redirection to have
4:26something positive um to focus on and something where you can feel back in
4:32back in control of something and I think when when anything like that happens we can see ourselves as failing at it and
4:39yet we didn’t fail it just wasn’t meant to be but it’s hard isn’t it to yeah to
4:46be kind enough to ourselves to acknowledge that and Find A Way Forward exactly that
4:52Kim because the pressure on me on that front was absolutely immense and not
5:00from my um my from my ex because I had nothing but support there but it was
5:07massive question other areas particular um from my parents who you know kept
5:15when you going to have a baby when is it going when were we going to be grandparents you’re leaving it too long what’s going on why is it not happening
5:22and I’d actually also had six early miscarriages with my ex and then after
5:28my son was still born I went on to have another four early marriages so it
5:34wasn’t for the want of of trying and having that pressure all the time my from my parents of when’s it GNA happen
5:40and you know it was yeah it was it was immense and that’s what really led to that massive fear of of of failure and
5:47feeling like I’d completely failed to do the one thing we would put on this Earth
5:52You know to to to to do because I had all that significant you know pressure of when am I going to make them
5:58grandparents yeah I I can I can empathize without having had my little
6:04girl late um I didn’t think I could have children and therefore spent all my life telling everybody I didn’t want them um
6:11rather than being honest and admitting I really did want them but it just wasn’t happening for me so I I can understand
6:17on a level how that can really push you to to focus on the things you can do to
6:23focus on something you can be in control of and to um really fill fill your time
6:30I think sometimes to stop you tot having the time to have to um think about it or
6:38or you know to to be able to have those positives in so tell me a bit more about your journey since then because in that
6:4410 years I mean you’ve packed a lot in yeah AB absolutely just quickly going
6:49back to something that you were saying then about um filling up the time that is so true because there’s a quote in
6:56one of my all-time favorite films um bohemian rapidy which is the bar pick of um Queen and Freddy Mercury where
7:03there’s a scene that Freddy’s just had this massive over-the-top party and he’s
7:08um on his own in his in his house and there’s um a waiter there that he talks
7:14to and you know the waiter said oh have your friends all left now and Freddy says yeah but they’re not my friends not
7:20not really and he said you know and the way to says well you know how come and
7:25Freddy says well they’re just a distraction really do they fill in the in between moments because if they weren’t there filling that time life
7:32would just be really unbearable and that’s that really resonated with w w
7:38with me and that’s been a big part of the 10 years or or so that I’ve done since you know I’ve I’ve lost my son
7:44it’s been all about filling in those in between moments when all that darkness when all that pain when all that trauma
7:52can come sort of G bubbling back up to the to to the surface um but in terms of
7:58of of my journey um it’s been quite an interesting one because I didn’t plan or set out to
8:05actually enter the cyber security industry it wasn’t really a conscious choice because I spent the first part of
8:12my career working with Chris tarant of Who Wants To Be A Millionaire um Fame
8:17and I I did that for a number of years and um when I felt I’d gone as far as I
8:23could with Chris I then was thinking about my next um career move but at the
8:30time my my ex was really high up as an ethical hacker penetration tester and I
8:36was always absolutely fascinated in the work that they did and um all the sort of human elements around um hacking and
8:43and cyber security so I was exposed to the industry um through their their work
8:49um for for quite a long time and then we went on to um found Titania limited
8:55which is a cyber security software development company and that was the point that I um transitioned into the
9:01industry back in um 2009 and then a few years um later in 2012 when we um
9:07separated and subsequently divorced I knew I wanted to stay within um cyber so
9:13I did um just that and then after I remarried and lost my son’s still birth
9:19I went on to work with BT and did some work on their Ral cyber product I’ve then branched out into the cyber
9:25security culture and awareness training side of things and I’ve worked with many organizations to roll out cyber
9:33awareness and training programs um for their Workforce and uh I then went on to found
9:40um cyber security Association which is now rebranded as um cyber security Unity
9:46I got asked to write for various trade Publications and other Publications um published a handful of
9:52books and the latest one came out on International women’s day which was the rise of the Cyber women um volume three
9:59which gives a voice to um all the many amazing women in cyber security and also
10:05um talks about that those that have nonlinear Pathways or Journeys into cyber um which is very much um something
10:12that happened uh to me um I speak at a lot of events um I also um as you said earlier
10:20um together we along with Nat we co-founded International imposter Sy awareness day um I’m a judge for various
10:27s security Awards I sit on on various boards as well so I really embraced it
10:32and really just got into as much as you know I I I I I can manage um and the
10:37Pinnacle of which was being awarded in MBE in King Charles’s first birthday on his list last year which is something
10:44that is so surreal and still something I haven’t got my um my head around then I mean we we talk a lot about imposter
10:51syndrome Goodness Me it went through the roof when I found out about that I can tell
10:57you I imagine is it’s in those moments isn’t it where we achieve something that it really it really spikes the dial on
11:05the fact that we don’t think that we should even if everybody else around us is telling us that we’ve earned it that
11:12we deserve it that the impact that we’re having it’s just recognition for that there’s um it almost make it almost
11:20certainly from for me and from when we’ve chatted about it it almost makes it um makes your internal Voice want to
11:28scream even loud absolutely they knew yeah it shouldn’t it shouldn’t be there
11:34and I know that’s kind of that that feeling and we’ve both um openly admitted that we’ve been sufferers for
11:40many years um was what drove us wasn’t it to to set up International imposter
11:46syndrome awareness day to help start the debate to have the conversation because
11:52you know when you’re in the throws of it the one thing that you won’t do is tell anybody then they’ll definitely know
11:57that you’re an impostor because you share it so you tend to like hold it back even more don’t you yeah absolutely
12:05and I think as as well for me I didn’t really know that it had um a name or
12:11that there was you know something like that I always had those feelings no matter what I did of I’m a fraud and I’m
12:19going to be found out at any second or you know this wasn’t meant for me it was meant for somebody else or even that
12:25fear of just not speaking up in in meetings because of you know I’m worried that if I did I would be seen as you
12:32know not knowing what what on Earth I’m talking about or you know and things like that so um it was quite an eye
12:39opener when I realized it was actually a real thing and even more of an eye opener when I realized how many people
12:45actually suffer from it um you know women and men alike across the board and
12:51that definitely led me to um you know looking at it into studying it and and
12:56so on and then LED of course to us um ing the day where we talk about it on um April the 13th and really open up that
13:04conversation so that people feel that they’re not alone because for years I felt that I was alone because of it and
13:11because it didn’t have a name or I didn’t know what it was um that isolation feeling was was really immense
13:19yeah and it it doesn’t matter how awful we talk to ourselves it sounds so
13:24plausible doesn’t it when you’re in those moments where where you’ll berating yourself on everything that
13:30hasn’t gone that hasn’t gone well um and I think is that’s part of why we’re doing it isn’t it’s to create that
13:37community that safe space where it’s okay to share that actually and I know
13:43we we’ve ched about it before it’s not about overcoming it it’s about learning the coping mechanisms to get through it
13:50quicker so that you can regain control isn’t it absolutely and that’s exactly
13:57how I like to reframe it Kim rather than conquering it or overcoming it I like to
14:03um come at it from managing imposter syndrome and putting things in place
14:09that work for for you as an individual um to help you manage it because like
14:15everything else there’s no one size fits all and what works for me may not work for you or may not work for for somebody
14:22else but um what I can do and what I’m really passionate about is sharing my lived experience of it
14:29and those examples where it’s really um you know Hit me hard especially when I
14:35was awarded my my MBA um for example so I I’ll Shar you know about that because
14:40people are ask me you know how do you feel about it how did you feel when you got notified and it’s like like I’m the
14:46biggest impostor on the planet and that it wasn’t meant for me so I I can imagine that because I think
14:54we um when you say it out loud you say it to other people you kind of can hear for yourself that that sounds odd can’t
15:02you yeah I remember winning nothing like an NBA but winning an award and thinking
15:08if only they knew if I’m just going to be found out I so bad I couldn’t even bring the award home because I didn’t
15:13feel I’d actually um earned it so it’s still I believe in the the office where it was given to me and it wasn’t because
15:20I wasn’t grateful for it but I didn’t feel it belonged when you kind of say that a lot
15:25people like what what would need to have been different for you to believe it and
15:32the fact is it’s inside that needs to be different it doesn’t matter what anybody else does externally for you it’s how
15:39you can um create the right strategies that work for you and as you say they
15:44what works for one person isn’t going to work for everybody and also it might not work for every situation so having a
15:50having lots of TS lots of things that’s going okay that’s not working for me today but maybe this can and can really
15:56help in those moments of catching ourselves and say is this what I really want to think yeah
16:03absolutely what do I want to think and how can I how can I take the steps to get me to get me
16:09there absolutely I mean I have a myriad of different things that I I use um one
16:15of the things I’ve been using recently actually came from something that you said to me Kim and I want to take the
16:21opportunity to say a massive thank you because you said to me once that a lot
16:27of the things that we say to ourselves and including impostor syndrome and you
16:32know that that critical selft talk that negative self talk that we say to ourselves would we say that to other
16:41people would we say that to our children no we we absolutely wouldn’t the way we
16:47talk to ourselves you’re you’re so right about this Kim the way we talk to ourselves is not how we would talk to
16:54other people and that’s really worked for me in terms of reframing those thoughts so when they starts to
17:02coming in I always you know think back to when you told me that and think no I wouldn’t say this to other people why on
17:09Earth am I saying this to myself oh I’m so glad it work for you and it’s so true isn’t it and I’ve said I’ve said things
17:15to myself that I wouldn’t say to another living person even I didn’t like I
17:20wouldn’t be as cruel as I’ve been to myself and and so you know I shared with you when when I find myself saying that
17:27I go would I say this to Scarlet who’s you know my North Star and I wouldn’t I
17:33so I’m now trying and say to myself what I’d say to her so I think about you if it were her what would I say right now I
17:39say that to myself um because it it it just helps jolt me into that imagine her
17:45little face if I ever said some of the things that I’ve said to myself and it’s heartbreaking to think what you know
17:52what they would say but yet we can be so cruel with ourselves can’t we we can we we can and following on from that I had
17:58another realization um recently as well and as you know I’ve done a lot of
18:04research into narcissism with narcissistic personality disorder and those with narcissistic personality
18:11traits and the reason for that is because I think that many people that um
18:17bully and abuse others in the workplace in particular and in um in in personal
18:23life and so on they can often have narcissistic personality traits if not
18:28the full-blown um Disorder so something else that I’ve realized is that
18:34narcissists will have no filter they will say those things to other people
18:41and they have no consequences or no empathy and they’re just totally devoid
18:47of it they just don’t have the faintest clue how what they’re saying impacts and
18:53affects other people and that was that um the realization that I came I came to
18:59was they do say those things to other people and they have no filter they have
19:05no consequences of of of doing that and that was a real light bulb moment for
19:10for me because it’s like it’s part of their DNA they’ll never change and they
19:16can’t help it and from a very young age I heard a lot of critical you know
19:22things aimed at at me from my own upbringing that have really stuck with
19:27me and it took years and years and years to really shed those negative beliefs and those you know those things that
19:34I’ve been told and that pressure to fit in and you know dress nicely and be this
19:41certain way and don’t let the side down because that was always you know you better behave yourself today because we
19:47don’t want you letting the side down and you better dress nicely we don’t want you letting the side down and that’s all I heard but I don’t think it was my
19:54parents’ fault that’s in their DNA that’s what they like and there’s they had no filter no consequence or no
20:01empathy to be able to understand how that affected me yeah and I think often
20:06it’s because they’ve been hurt that way themselves and I don’t mean that from a excuse the behavior but just understand
20:14no you’re right yeah you know I was saying this to Scot the other day she had little boy who was mean to her and
20:19she came home and we ched about how she felt and and and obviously went through her emotions and then we ched about what
20:26might be going on in his world and she like what do you mean me and I said well people don’t hurt us on purpose they’re usually dealing with their own pain and
20:32we’re collateral damaged they don’t actually consider us in the slightest I said so maybe next time ask how he is so
20:41she came back the next day she was like Mommy he was mean to me again and I said oh was he my darling and she said yeah
20:46but I said to him are you okay would you like a cuddle um and I said okay what
20:52happened to them she went he said yes please um she said and he’s been really kind to me for the rest of the day and
20:58and I was like because we just don’t know you people learn this Behavior so somebody they’ve had to have seen it
21:04just like we’ve learned our behavior and we have to um see it and then we can
21:10choose whether or not we do something about it um but I think you know if we can if we can try and start to
21:17understand the causes and for me one of my big eye openers was when I stopped
21:23trying to get um empathy from somebody who wasn’t able to give it actually they
21:31were dealing with their own pain and so when you shared the pain they were putting you through they it just was
21:38frustrated them because they were like well I’m already in pain and now you’re making me deal with your pain it’s like
21:43my pain comes as a result of yours um but but it was those parts going okay I need to understand where I can help fix
21:51my pain without needing to get that fix from you and that was for me where I
21:57started on my journey to to kind of really understand why do we do this to ourselves where does it come from and
22:03how do we unpick um the beliefs that we’ve created that usually have come
22:08from our childhood yeah absolutely reinforce them as we’ve gone through our adult life because they become like our
22:15blueprint don’t they until we work on them until we understand what they are and then we can create better ones that
22:22serve us better absolutely and also that we decide or we make that decision that
22:28we’re going going to break that generational cycle and that it stops right here right now with me so that I
22:35don’t go on to hurt any other gener subsequent you know generations and I
22:40think that that’s something that um many of the previous generations they they just didn’t do it was all button you
22:46know s of buttoned up it was all that um you know stiff up a lip we don’t you know show our feelings we don’t talk
22:52about our feelings we don’t yeah and that all that’s got to go somewhere so it’s going to overspill and and you know
22:59go out to every to to everybody else um but there also does come a point where
23:05another thing I’ve learned is you just have to know when to just go no and walk
23:12away from it because the impact that that kind of behavior has on your own
23:18well-being on your own you know selft talk it it’s beyond toxic sometimes and
23:25it’s it’s just at that point where no matter who it is you’ve just got to take a stand and go toxic is toxic and I am
23:33not going to engage in this for my own well-being anymore and it’s really hard
23:41to do because when I did that and started to set healthy boundaries my
23:46goodness it escalated in ways that I would never have have imagined and this
23:52was from people who are professed to love me more than anything in the world as well but I took that that stamps is
23:59like no I’m setting healthy boundaries here the fact that they’re being pushed
24:04against so much really does show me how boundaryless I was and that spilled over
24:12into everything so I was I would take on everything at work I would reply to
24:17things out of hours I would be up at 3 in the morning sorting something out if it needed you know doing I was totally
24:23Bound boundaryless in every aspect in every area of of my life and now that
24:29I’m I’ve put those boundaries in place life is just so much um better but it’s
24:34hard it’s really hard to do is and I so empathized with that because I was a
24:41lifelong people pleaser and had no boundaries for for myself at all in in any direction and
24:48actually it’s really hard when you start putting them in um but for me that was my first breakthrough of demonstrating
24:56some level of self-care and some level of selflove and for me
25:01that felt like a real triumphant breakthrough that it was like actually I am worth being able to set a boundary
25:09that doesn’t make doesn’t make me a bad person to not be able to take on
25:14everybody else’s challenges all of the time I’ll do whatever I can to help anybody but I also have to now help
25:23myself as well because I think for me that the saying that really really hit home was
25:28you can’t pour from an empty cup and it was until you realized the C getting really empty that it was like okay I
25:35need to do us something now to to balance that because if not I can’t be there to to you know to be a good M for
25:42scarlet or to be a good friend for my friends or to be a good um colleague to
25:47to be helpful um anywhere because you can’t constantly run on empty can you
25:54absolutely the analogy for me that’s very similar was I um did a course long ago to become a
26:01neurodiversity in the workplace trainer because I myself am neurod Divergent um
26:06was diagnosed with autism and ADHD and the analogy that um came up
26:12during the course was that when you’re on an airplane if there’s an incident in the oxygen masks come down they always
26:19say to you to get your own oxygen mask on first before you help other people
26:24get their oxygen masks on and that really hit home with with me it’s very similar to you can’t pour from an empty
26:30cup and it’s similar in that you have to get your own oxygen mask on prioritize
26:36yourself before you can help other people with their oxygen masks and it’s so true it is it’s so true and that was
26:42one that I never really understood for a long time which is a bit ridiculous because I surely I’d want to put
26:47Scarlets on first until I until I thought about and what next so what if I get Scarlets on and then I can’t get my
26:54own on and then she’s on her own and where would where would she go whereas if I get mine on I’m better able to help
27:00her so it was it was it was actually one of those analogies that really does resonate because for years I’ve got well
27:06that doesn’t make any sense to me that just demonstrates quite how far I was down the whole pie of piece but I hadn’t
27:13done the next step to realize that in not doing it I was actually going to put her in more harm not in in a safer space
27:21and it was once you make that breakthrough I think that it um it really helps start to um form a new way
27:27of thinking doesn’t it and new A New Path forward so you’ve already done so
27:32so very much but what would you say has been the greatest lesson you’ve learned so
27:38far I oh gosh I’ve got a few but I had a particularly um traumatic experience
27:46about two or three years ago when somebody who was helping me get the UK cyber security association off the
27:52ground um actually in the end um targeted me with a h huge campaign of
27:59bullying and abuse and not just because of aimed at me it was actually also
28:05aimed at others within the organization this individual then went on to Target my accountant solicitor who was in
28:12involved and it only stopped when it was reported to the police and the police got involved so I think the the biggest
28:21lesson for me from that is that I was done with cyber security I was coming
28:26out the industry I was going to close the association down I was not going to have anything to do with cyber security
28:32ever again but and for a little while I did go into Logistics and I I worked for Logistics UK for a for for a while and I
28:42guess for for me the biggest lesson is time it’s a cliche but time really does
28:47heal all wounds and that’s one thing I’ve learned is to just not straight
28:53away come out of something or dismiss something out of hand um like that
28:58because after a while it was oh I miss cyber I want to go back into doing it and then you eventually I I I did so um
29:06I think for for me is not letting um bullies or abusers if you are subject to
29:12to to that um win in any way and as you said earlier it could well be that
29:18they’re dealing with other stuff in their lives and it’s spilling out you know into into how they’re they’re treating you um but recognize that it’s
29:25not you in any way shape or form and having had that experience throughout my
29:31entire lifetime I can absolutely say it said nothing whatsoever about me but
29:38said everything about them so it is not you if you are the target of bullies and
29:45abuses and that’s my my my biggest lesson because for years it was it must be me what can I change what can I do um
29:52I’ve got a whole load of self-help books over there that I was reading cover to cover looking for that answer of how can
29:58I how can I change so that I won’t be bullied or abused or or targeted and it
30:05was never me Kim it was never about me it was all about those who chose to do it and it said everything about them but
30:12nothing about me that’s so true yeah I always say to Scarlet you know we don’t
30:17get to choose how somebody behaves towards us but we do get to choose how we respond that’s right response that we
30:25have control over and and that response can be walk away yeah don’t don’t have
30:30to stay there if you’re not you know if you’re not being treated well um and I say that now having not walked away what
30:38I should have done on more more than one occasion in my life and and continued to be the dog to kick um and it’s like
30:46actually once you learn that peace on healthy boundaries and once you realize it actually isn’t about you you all you
30:52can do is be the best version of yourself every day and you know I set myself the every day to be a better
30:59version of myself than I was yesterday but that’s all I can control I can’t control anything else and and that was
31:05quite liberating once I got to that piece um which was I’m never going to be perfect and that’s
31:11okay but that doesn’t doesn’t allow me to not be the best I can be yeah but
31:18before I hadn’t realized that they are mutually exclusive they have you don’t have to do
31:25both um to get there um so so I love that you’ve got those lessons as well um
31:31what what if you could go back and give your younger self a piece of advice what would it
31:36be again going back to the bullying and abuse that I experienced I would I would
31:42absolutely you know say don’t take it to heart when you’re targeted because as I
31:49said I did I absolutely did I was convinced it was all made and it was all
31:54my fault that I must have done or said something or caused them to act in that
32:00way um towards me um and I would I would also say as well another piece of advice
32:06is go for those things fortune favors the Bold you know if there’s an
32:11opportunity or there’s some you want ask for it send that email make that phone call you for a long time I would always
32:18be oh better not do that or I’m not quite qualified for that or I’m not quite you know right for for that and
32:25there are times when I wish I’d just sent that email and asked or pick up or picked up the phone or or whatever it
32:32was um so just Ju Just it’s real cliche again but just just do it because you
32:38never know where it might lead it’s it was Mark said in 20 years it won’t be
32:45the things you did that you regret it will be the things that you didn’t do yeah I try remind myself of that when
32:50I’m procrastinating finding a million reasons why it really isn’t the right
32:56thing to do but actually when you’ve just gone for it when you’ve just done it that’s usually when as you say
33:02opportunity does favor the Bold So Lisa as we come towards an end what’s next
33:07for you um gosh there are still things I really want to do so I’m working at the
33:14moment on a couple of um book ideas that I want to um develop because I’ve had my
33:20um books on wom on women in cyber security and so on but I want to focus on um a couple of other things that are
33:26quite close um to my my heart um and who knows eventually I’d like to um perhaps
33:32even do a doctorate or something like like that I would I I would love to um to to add that as well to to to to my
33:39list and and perhaps do um something more within the Realms of cyber psychology so yeah I’m I’m not done
33:46there’s a lot lot more that I want to uh I want to do and I have every Faith you will achieve every single bit it and I
33:53look forward to having you back on to share with us how you’re progressing with that so how can people get in touch
33:59with you um I’m quite active on LinkedIn and um and Twitter my um tag is cyber
34:06geek girl um you can also find me on the cyber security Unity website which is csu.org and of course the international
34:15imposter syndrome Awareness Day website which is IIs ad.org um please do join us
34:22on the 13th of April um we’re going to really open up the conversation on that day about impostor syndrome um so do
34:29check the site and see what we’ve got planned amazing and yeah absolutely do get involved and all of the details of
34:36how to get in touch with Lisa will be in the show notes below so if you didn’t get a chance to write any of that down
34:41don’t worry they’ll be right behind here and getting in touch Lisa it’s been a
34:46delight as always thank you so much for coming on and and being so open and
34:52sharing your journey because I think in sharing our lived experience we help
34:57other people realize that they’re not alone and I commend your your compassion for others and your
35:05dedication to leaving things better than you found them thank you Kim it’s been a real pleasure to be here today thanks
35:13until next time
35:19okay
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